Boy Moms Talk Gender "Disappointment"

Gender disappointment. Maybe you’ve heard this term, maybe you haven’t, but it definitely isn’t openly talked about enough. Gender disappointment is a very real parenthood experience which involves holding a preference for having a daughter or a son, then experiencing emotional distress when baby’s sex does not match that vision. But disappointment is only the tip of the iceberg. Often the feelings to follow are ones of grief, guilt, or even shame.

In this episode Jacqueline connects with Cori Leary, a fellow boy mom, to discuss the topic of gender disappointment. Cori shares her experiences with pregnancy including the honest emotions she felt when finding out she was expecting a second boy. Take a listen as we help squash the shame that many women feel surrounding this topic and learn why these feelings can present themselves in the first place.

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• 13:47 (Cont.) Boy Moms Talk Gender "Disappointment"

Transcript

Hey friends, I hope you're having a great day. Maybe you're on your commute to work or dropping the kids off, picking them up. Hopefully you're relaxing somewhere, maybe with a nice cup of coffee as you listen to this. Maybe you're like me and are like doing the dishes or cleaning.  These are times when I often have my AirPods in and I'm just listening to all my favorite podcasts, trying to pass the time while I'm doing tasks that I'm not really caring about, you know, dishes, not fun.

But what is fun is today's conversation. I'm really excited about this topic Because this episode is really what motherhood intended is all about, you know, when I started this podcast My goal was to have conversations surrounding infertility and motherhood that go beyond the highlight reels that were all scrolling on social Media,  like the next person.

I love a curated feed I love a good photo and the interesting funny reels that I watch But I know, and you know, behind every photo, behind every video is a story,  real emotions and experiences. And my job is to bring those to life for you. So today we're talking about the topic of gender disappointment.

You've probably heard this word. It's a bit of a buzzword, but it's a really real emotion that moms, and even dads, can experience. So, while gender disappointment is the phrase that you've heard, of course we are not talking about just gender. We are talking about your baby's biological sex. finding out the biological sex of your baby and possibly being disappointed in that.

Now, as you'll hear in this episode, it goes much deeper than that. To be completely honest, I hate the term gender disappointment because disappointment, that, that word, that emotion is just. A fraction of what this is all about. It is rooted in the way we grew up our expectations, dreams we've had and roles that society has placed on gender.

 Before I share this conversation with you, I of course want to remind you of some important things. I'm going to keep it simple by just saying, check the show notes of the episode. Anything you might want to connect with is linked in there. You can join the Motherhood Intended Community group on Facebook.

You can follow along on Instagram. You can apply to be a guest on the show, grab my free resource, a month by month roadmap to your fertility success, and also learn more about surrogacy. And speaking of surrogacy, quick update in my journey. Our surrogate is currently 28 weeks along, which is such a super exciting milestone.

We are officially in the third trimester. And I share my story with you really just to bring you hope if you are still trying to create your family, or maybe you started a surrogacy journey , there is hope in every situation,  if you've listened to my story, tuned into episodes one or two, or even the beginning of the season, I have been through a lot.

And I've experienced a lot throughout my decade of trying to grow my family.  And I'm taking this moment while I am, of course, still anxious and nervous and having a hard time wrapping my head around that, like, this is actually going to happen for us. It's hard to imagine it because I have experienced so much loss, especially with,  know losing three girls and now we're expecting a girl.

There's  a little bit of PTSD there  but i'm telling you these emotions and how i'm feeling because if you were in a similar situation, Maybe you're in a pregnancy after a loss.

I just want you to know that  all your feelings are valid. You know, I am excited and hopeful, but anxious and terrified of this not working out again.  I know in my core, I have extreme confidence in our surrogate and the whole pregnancy thus far has been just Perfect. I mean, I probably say this every week, but I am in awe that women are so selfless and that will help another family grow their family.

And of course, given my experience with pregnancy, it's just wild to me to watch somebody be so happy and healthy and active while pregnant, because that is just not what I experienced. So we are very, very excited to be in the third trimester. So I just wanted to share that with you today.

And if you want to follow along on our journey, definitely check out Instagram at motherhood underscore intended. We've been working on the nursery and we'll have a reveal for that coming soon.

But more importantly, today's guest is Kory. She's a full time human resources professional, wife and mother of two boys ages two and four. She has embraced her boy mom status and has dedicated her time, energy and resources to creating fulfilling experiences for her family.

Take a listen.

 Hi, Cory. Welcome to the Motherhood Intended podcast. I'm super excited to have you on the show today. We're going to be talking about a topic that I find really interesting.  Mostly because it's not something that a lot of people talk about. We're going to be sharing our experiences with gender disappointment.

So before we dive into, your experience with that and mine, tell me a little bit about yourself. How many kids do you have? How long have you been married? Share a little bit about yourself. 

My name is Corey Leary, and I have two kids. They're both boys. Chase, who is going to be four years old in a couple days, and then I also have Emmett, who is two.

My husband and I have been married for about eight and a half years now. Can't believe it's been that long. But we both work full time. And you know, just spend a lot of our free time just trying to create as many experiences with our boys as possible. We like to do a lot of stuff. We stay very busy. But it's fun. It's really fun. 

Yeah, that's so awesome. And foreign, too.  Are your boys close together?  Do they get along for the most part? 

For the most part. I think they're getting a little bit to the age where, you know, my oldest,  was used to having free reign of all of the, the toys, you know, the Hot Wheels and all those sorts of things.

Yeah. Um, and now his younger brother is trying to come in and, and play along, and he just wants to play, but, yeah, you know, there's a little bit of jealousy there, but for the most part, they're really good boys, and they really, they, They play very well. 

Yeah, that's awesome.  My boys are about the same, um, except just a couple years ahead. So, my youngest is four and then my older one will be six in March. And,  I feel like it goes in waves, right? Yeah, like when they're, like, when they were little. Yeah, It was just  a lot of my youngest one kind of following him around. Just really  joining in. And the older one trying to learn how to share and do all the things.

 But then, like, at this point, they're, they're like best friends. The amount of time they spend together, I mean, sure, like any sibling, they get in their ways and they, you know, get sick of each other and all those things. But overall, it's pretty cool to watch them,  be so close and play together at this point. And now that they're, they can do the same, a lot of the same things at this point.  

Yes, that is true and it's, you know, when they give each other a hug, it's just the best thing in the world. 

Oh my goodness. Yes. Yes. That's awesome. So you've been married, you said, eight and a half years?

Yes. 

So did you guys, have a plan where you, wanted to wait a little bit to have children or did you Try to start your family and  what did that  look like for you?

 Yeah, so We did wait a little bit. We waited about four years i'd say,  to have children You know, there were a few trips that we had wanted to do before we had kids Um, you know, I grew up in my, and my mother didn't have, well,  I have one brother, so it was me and my brother, um, and my mother had me when she was 30.

And I kind of had the same, you know, mindset, like, hey, I don't have to, we don't have to start right away. Let's just enjoy being married for a few years. And so we did, and it was great, and I have no regrets about that. Yeah.   Because we knew we wanted to have kids, we just weren't in that big of a rush.

So, yeah, yeah, exactly. And so,  when we decided to have,  our first child, which was Chase, you know, I went off birth control. And we were pregnant within three months, so it was, fairly easy, everything went very smoothly, and it was great. 

That's all you can ask for. That's amazing. Yeah. So prior to, starting your family, you said you grew up with one brother. Did you have a a dream or kind of like a fantasy of what your family might look like, whether it's how many kids you had or girls and boys. I know we all like to play this little game, you know, ever since I was little, I was like, okay, when I'm going to get married, I'm going to have this amount of kids. I'm going to have two girls and two boys. And it's just going to be like, as if you can pick these things. Um, what was your initial vision for your family? 

Yeah. So when I was growing up, you know, I,  Well, I wasn't, you know, dreaming about having kids as much as some others were,  I was, more in the career planning mindset my whole life, you know, I was the oldest child straight A student, you know, all of that,  but I did,  as I started to, you know, date my husband and was thinking, oh, this, this might go somewhere.

My picture of what the family would look like would be two kids and a boy and a girl. And,  that was just what I've always known. That's what most of the people that I grew up with, to be honest with you. You know, I knew a lot of my friends, they had a brother or sister. And, that was kind of my vision of the perfect family, so to speak, based off what works.

Around me, so I had always imagined having a boy first, so an older boy, and then, you know, a little sister that,  the boy could protect, and you know, all that stuff that, you know, you hear that narrative quite a bit, and, that's kind of what I envisioned as well. 

Yeah, it's interesting because I was thinking the same, well, so I'm,  one of four, I have one sister and two brothers, and so, yeah, growing up, same thing, once I found my husband,  and we were both on the same page, we wanted a big family and everything, and I'm like, I want, I want four kids, I was one of four, like, He was one of three.

I'm, I'm like, that sounds amazing. And two boys, two girls, so it's even they each have someone to play with was kind of my vision. And yeah, for whatever reason, I, again, I'm the oldest as well. And I wanted a boy first because  I wanted an older boy, take care of his little sister.

And maybe that's just like coming from the oldest sister in me, like, oh man, I wish I would have had that  kind of thing. But yeah, of course, that's just not how life works.  It's interesting to dream and have these things and what you're used to, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's gonna work out that way. When you were pregnant, whether the first time or both times, did you guys decide to find out, the sex of the baby ahead of time?  

We did. So with Chase, my oldest, we had the whole thing, like the gender reveal, and  we did cake pops as our gender reveal, which I will suggest nobody ever do because it was a long, arduous process. I ended up crying. My husband was like, just go away. I'll finish it. It was, it was a process because we actually found out prior to doing the gender reveal. We did the gender reveal for our, Okay. Yeah,  um, and yeah, I was like the second that I could know,  I was I was on top of it I was like I need to know I need to plan, you know, I'm that typical type a personality I'm like I need to get everything, you know matchy matchy for the nursery and like and all that All that kind of stuff.

So, I was actually really excited when I found out that Chase was a boy.  That's what  I had envisioned, the older boy, and then, you know, a few years down the road, we'd have the little girl, and then,  it would be  the perfect family. So yeah, , we were really excited about Chase. We had his name picked out for years. And  our family seemed very excited as well. So it was all, it was great. 

That's so exciting. And it's kind of what everyone seems to be doing these days. I mean, I know there are people who I'm just like, yo type a, I need to know, I need to plan. I like to like visually,  try to imagine what my life is about to look like, and I don't know, finding out the baby sex kind of always helped with that for me, and I was excited too, to have a boy first, like you said, that's kind of what I envisioned, and I was like, perfect, this is great, this is so exciting, And it's funny you said cake pops because that's why I was like, Oh, you made them yourself because we did cake pops for my second son and I ordered them though.

And I was like, Ooh, what was your experience? Like, why was it so bad? But I don't think I'm not a baker. There's no way I could have like attempted to make them at all. 

It was just like the chocolate was just all over the place. And we chose to do white as the outside. Okay. Yeah. And so like, Any little space that you didn't have covered, you could see the blue right through it and it was just, it was a process. So, a note for, for everybody out there, anyone else,  just get,  just get somebody to do them for you. Cause it was, you know, an adventure, a whole thing. Yeah. 

Oh my gosh. That's too funny. Okay. So  the second time around, did you guys find out again ahead of time? 

Yes, we did. Yeah. 

So after, obviously you just said that you had envisioned a boy and a girl, what were you feeling when you found out that you were having another boy? 

So when I found out, you know, I was actually at work at the time. I got a phone call and they asked, you know, do you want to, do you want to know? And of course they had already told me that, you know, everything came back fine and, and appearingly it was healthy. And I was like, uh, should I wait for my husband or should I not wait and of course I didn't so yeah, I had them tell me and they said, Oh, you're you're having a little boy.

And, for me, I was just almost a little bit in shock. I wasn't necessarily disappointed at that time. I was just kind of like, oh, like, this is not what I thought it was going to be, you know, I thought that we'd have a boy and a girl and I was, at that time, they're definitely set on.

We are definitely having only two, you know, this is what I've always been told is the right thing to do, you know, if you have more than two, it's not fair to the kids, which, you know, is a whole other topic we could discuss, but, 

oh yeah, there's all these narratives that we've been taught along the way, for sure.

Exactly.  But I was just really shocked and kind of like hung up the phone, went for a walk outside, was kind of like, okay, well, I'm. Just kind of have to be okay with this and you know, so it's kind of strange I was kind of ruminating on it for a while before I told my husband.  And then when I told him, you know, I started crying and I was like, oh my gosh, it's like, no, I love my little boy but like, you know, I, I wanted a girl, you know, and I, and I could kind of tell that he did too.

I kind of  got the sense from him that he kind of wanted a little girl as well. And, um, he's one of four boys. So, you know, I think that's why  it wasn't totally unexpected for me, but it was still like,  darn, you know, yeah, so  throughout that time, I wasn't even really excited to tell anybody  because in my mind, you know, everybody wanted a girl,  that's all you hear is when you say that you already have a boy. You know, I hope it's a girl,  I hope it's a girl and 

people love to say that and even if you've already have to if you have two boys, then they'll be like, Are you going to try for a girl? Are you going to try for a girl?  Really disregarding like, number of kids, all the other decisions that go into having a child, just Yeah, thinking about girl or boy.

The fact that you can't guarantee it either way, even if you try for another one, you know, yeah, there's no guarantee you're going to have one. Totally.  And so I was just not very excited to tell people  when I did tell people, you know, I kind of got the sense that they weren't as excited.

I didn't really know if that was just because it's the second child versus, it is. Another boy or both. Yeah, but you know, it just didn't seem as exciting as the first time and I kind of went through the pregnancy and over time,  I was alright with it You know, I was just like alright like two boys like,  I already got this boy mom thing down.

So yeah, why? Not just do it again, you know and as I said, I love my boy and I love my boys both of them right and It's fun being a boy mom,  I tried to kind of tell myself those things as I went through, so I'd say that I was disappointed at that time, but not as disappointed as later on, and,  I can kind of explain that a little bit more.

I would love to hear more.    I think everyone's heard like the term gender disappointment, I've even heard it before, and I knew that I felt it. felt it. But then when I hear the word disappointment, I'm like, I think that was like, yeah, like maybe my initial feeling, but there's so much more to it than that.

And there's so much more  that goes into like, why these feelings come up and you kind of touched on some of them, you know, with gender disappointment,  Reasons that this could play into it, things like family pressures, you know, people saying like, oh, I hope you get a girl or, or just kind of what you've pictured with other families that you know in your life.

For some people it's like the fear of the unknown,  some people might not want the opposite sex because they are like, I don't know, I know what I'm doing. I finally got this down pat. I would love another of the same sex, I know for me, you know, prior traumatic experiences when I also found out we were having a boy the first time, you know, our miscarriages were girls and for me. 

Having a boy and getting,  further in my pregnancy and bringing a boy home was like, okay, this feels different. This feels positive. It's not tied to like the negative experience that I had. And then for me, with our second, I was Static to, I didn't really care either way at that point.

Because again, I had this idea in my mind that I was going to have four kids and it just, there was time. It didn't matter. I thought I had figured out my fertility issues and all of that. And, um, so having a second boy, I was like, Oh my gosh, they're close in age. It'll be so fun. They'll be close brothers.

And there's time, there's time to have. more. But that's just not how it all works. No one knows the future and, or how many kids you're capable of having, even if you say you want four. So it's, it's really interesting,  gender disappointment starts off as like this feeling, just like a feeling of kind of like sadness when you've got this strong desire to, have a child of a certain sex, but it, it morphs into different things as parenting goes on, I think.

Yeah. And when I was  pregnant with my second boy, and I knew about it for the majority of the pregnancy. Yeah. And, I would go on to online forums and things like that, you know, these, these places that were supposed to be for boy moms and all of this stuff.

And I was like, well, maybe that'll help, and really, I found that it almost made it worse because when I'd go on to these things, things.  Would be people that would post, Oh guys, I finally got my girl, like baby number three. I finally got my girl, you know? And it just like, or people that were like, Oh, I just found out I'm having my fourth boy.

Like this is the worst thing ever. Like I haven't stopped crying for days. And yeah, it really just, it almost. Pushed that pressure and that disappointment further because it's like oh well boys are not as good as girls clearly I mean everybody seems to think it so like it almost it almost made it worse because of that is just going on and seeing that really it's just Everybody has everybody you seemingly has this idea that  boys are not as Desired as girls when it comes  And, you rarely see anybody go on and say, well, you know, I'm having my second girl. I'm so upset about it. You don't see that as much. So I'm sure it can happen. But, 

totally agree. It's, it's very, it's really interesting. That's true, I didn't have any personal experience going into like certain forums like that, but just like even now, being into different mom groups and things like that, , yeah, there's definitely this like narrative around the boy thing and it's actually started bothering me recently, you know, boys are a little bit older at four and six, people love to say like, oh, they're all boy when they're like, yeah. Misbehaving or something and I'm like, no, I know what they're capable of and what they're doing and it's not because they're boys It's because they're like genuinely like not listening right now or on the flip side like they'll be like Oh, good luck. Like boys are this and boys are that. And I'm like, well, you know, each of my boys also have two different personalities and they're very unique and it's just a different experience even within the two of them.

So I just, it's hard when, everyone categorizes girls in one section, boys in another.  And I think that's part of kind of like the idea of  gender disappointment is it's not like, Disappointment in the baby that you have it's disappointment based on like all the stereotypes we know of each gender.

And of course, when we're talking about gender, we're talking about, you know, like biological sex, whether you are having a boy or having a girl and everything we, perceive belong in those categories, right? What, what we think that parenting a boy or a girl looks like, and obviously there's differences, but the dramatics  on the boys side of things is just, it's hard. And I can see how, especially when you're, you know, navigating this kind of like disappointment at first, it's, it's gotta just heighten everything. 

Yeah, and  once my second son, you know came obviously I like I love them I love them to death, you know, I would never trade either of them for a girl at this point I was like that from The time that he was born, you know, I was like, this is going to be great.

I could see that brotherly bond already forming. And I was like, you know, it doesn't matter. Like it doesn't matter whether we have a boy or a girl, this journey is what I make of it. And so I was good for a very long time and really didn't have much of disappointment. I mean, every now and then, you know, I'd see like, you know, the cute little dresses and stuff.

And I would just kind of be like, oh, you know, yeah, I'll never be able to buy those, and that kind of thing. But, you know, what really What happened for me is  I would say, the worst gender disappointment that I had actually came later, about seven months after, Emmett, my youngest, was born.

Okay. 

So, I think my journey's a little bit different in that It came later. So it was about seven months after Emmett was born, all of a sudden, within maybe three months,  I had three friends and or family members that were pregnant and announced that they were pregnant. All three of them were having girls.

Two of which had already had boys close in age to Chase.  And then they came out and were like, well, now we've got our girl, you know? And so there was examples of that perfect, ideal family that I had had in my mind for however long. And that was actually the point where I was just kind of like, wow, this kind of sucks.

You know, like, I was like, how come they got that ideal family, but I didn't, you know, it was like almost kind of shoved into my face within a three month period, like, wow, how come I got two boys and they all got girls. 

You know, probably at a time to if you said it was like, you know, seven months after having your son, you had already worked halfway through the pregnancy and, enjoyed him when he was born, all these things and probably got to a mental spot where you're like acceptance and just in the moment and loving your family.

And then, it's triggering when then you see, especially like that, like you said, in such a short period of time, so many people close to you getting the picture that you thought,  you wanted.  

Yeah, and. And seeing, the  one girl that was in part of my family, you know, how everybody was so excited about the girl, you know, because there's mostly boys in that family.

So she's, she's got a girl coming. We can't wait to shop. You know, it was a clear change. from what I got when I announced my second,  being a boy.  So,  it really took me a long time to kind of get through it because that is where I would say I had the worst gender disappointment, was during those months leading up to all three of those Babies being born.

Yeah. I was dealing with seeing it constantly, people talking about it or getting excited for it, all the baby showers, you know, like all that stuff. And it really was tough for me to kind of work through at that point. And it took me a long time to really  kind of work through those emotions and really.

Be okay with it again, and because it was, it was almost kind of like a relapse there, like I was fine for a while, I'd gotten over it, and then it just came sweeping back, and  in a worse way. 

Yeah.  When you're working through this or struggling with this, is this just you, yourself, and I, or have, did you openly talk about this with your husband, or verbalize it to someone else you trusted, or is it kind of something that you kept to yourself during this period of time?

Um. Yeah, so I mostly kept it to myself. I did verbalize it a little bit to my husband, but you know, he just doesn't, he didn't seem to understand it quite as much. He's just like, well, well, you'll still get to like see those girls and like buy stuff for them. I'm like, that's not the point. I'm like, you know, yeah, I was going through all the stuff that  I've been taught throughout for forever, all those narratives that I've heard, you know, the saying, like, a son is a son until he takes a wife, but a daughter is a daughter all her life.

Like, yeah, you know, all the people that are like, Oh, well, you know, the boys, they leave, you know, they don't, they don't care about their moms. They're not going to hang out with you when they're older. Um, What else? There was, there was so many. 

There's so many. I've heard, I've heard those same ones and it's always weighed on my mind. I think a lot of times too, just being women ourselves, you know, like it's not just the, buying the dresses, or the cute little clothes for girls. It's like long term, we know all the experiences that we've had. And so I think when it comes to having a girl or a boy, like. There's just so many experiences with our boys that we obviously didn't go through ourselves.

And so like the idea of having a girl and like kind of just relating in that way and passing down certain things, it just kind of heightens everything. But yeah, man, there are so many things when it comes to  boys and 

And people believe them, you know, and you're almost grieving this picture of.  A daughter that  that doesn't even exist, for me, I had to kind of put it into perspective and be like, look, even if I did have a daughter, like, who says they're going to be my best friend and want to do everything that I do and want to hang out with me when they're older. And just because I have a boy.

Why do I think that the boy is just gonna be like, well, see you later. I'm not gonna talk to you again, you know? I mean, my, my brother himself, you know, he, he hangs out with my mother pretty much every weekend. Yeah. So like, you know, why am I? Why am I holding  this narrative so closely? Why am I  believing it this much and Letting it impact my life that much, you know, that's something yeah that I had to tell myself over and over again like you have the power to Influence the relationship you have with your kids what no matter What gender or sex they are, you know, you're the one that's in control of that.

If you want them to want to be a part of your life when you're older, or if you want your future daughter in law or son in law or whatever, you know, if you want all of that in the future, you know, you have to work towards that. You have to build those relationships. You have to set expectations and you have to be the one to drive that.

And you can't just get caught up in what the world is telling you is going to happen because you don't know that, you know, and as you said, each of your boys has a different personality, they have their own, you know, likes and dislikes and things that they enjoy. And, not everybody's the same. So I really had to kind of. Become aware  of those societal and family influences that were really clouding my view of my own life, you know, what I had. 

Yeah, totally. And I feel like we don't even maybe even notice all of those different things that we've been taught over the years until you're in a position like this and you're like, Kind of fighting against it because you're like, well, this is, this is my situation and it doesn't have to be that way, but you know, had you had the girl, I'm sure maybe these thoughts would have just stuck with you because it's all kind of panned out the way you were taught and the way, that we all kind of like imagined it would be based off what we've been told growing up and everything.

But when you said, it was like grieving the loss of having a girl, it really is. I mean, they talk about it a lot in like the say the infertility community where you have to kind of grieve the loss of the idea of the way that you would have children. And I think this topic is very similar.

I mean, you had the idea in your head for so long of what you imagined, what you kind of saw your life as as a parent, and that was  changed and,  you have to grieve the loss of what that looked like, just like anything, any plan, you know, I've been through it in more ways than one, you know, whether it was how I conceived to how I'm bringing a baby home, the number of kids I have, you know, everything, it's just, you're grieving the fantasy and the dream that you had and learning to accept the reality and what you said, I completely agree with.

You're in control. You know, it's, it's about relationships. It's about being a good parent, regardless if you have boys or girls, and you will have the relationship you want with your kids if you put the work into it, regardless if they are the same sex as you or not, you know, I think that's so, so important to mention.

I know you said you mostly kept it to yourself at this point, do you think those around you could they tell your disappointment in the situation, or maybe notice that you were struggling with it? That might not even be a fair question to ask, I'm just curious 

So I feel like they, I think my husband definitely could. You know, I think he heard more of the feelings that I had, and he got the most of the truth, from me on kind of how I was feeling and some of those raw emotions that would come up from time to time because some days I was fine and it didn't bother me and other days it did.

Yeah. Um, but, you know, the others around me, you know, I, I don't think so. I don't think they got it because, I mean, they could see how much I do enjoy being a boy mom, you know, they could see how much I love my kids, and I don't. Think that I let on as much about how much I struggle, maybe when I was pregnant with my second and I was announcing it, maybe people got like a hint of the disappointment.

But I think. You know, it, people weren't as aware when I was struggling when everybody around me was having girls, and I tried to keep it pretty quiet because, you know, this is something that a lot of people don't want to talk about. They either don't want to put out there that they're disappointed because they don't want their kids to, think that they were disappointed by them, which, you know, I could say is the farthest from the truth.

I love my kids. Right. And I'm not disappointed that they're here and I'm not disappointed in who they are. But I also think people just, people don't want to share   when they're almost jealous of somebody else, you know, that's what it comes off as a lot. And I think if more people did talk about it and you know, one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about it with you is maybe we could have these discussions where we're putting things into perspective for people,  

we're not just accepting it for what it is,  and just continuing to perpetuate these narratives, I really think it would help if people we're honest about it. at least that's what I feel. 

I completely agree. Which is why when you brought up this topic, I was pretty excited to talk about it because I had heard the phrase gender disappointment talked about before. I didn't ever really pinpointed the feelings myself. And for me, it wasn't necessarily,  Like we said, gender disappointment is such a blanket term, I kind of feel like there needs to be a different  phrase for it because it's so much more complicated than that and I feel like disappointment is like the initial like quick reaction, but then it goes  much deeper than that, like you said, just all the things that we've been taught and, what we envision for our family and,  I agree. I think talking about it is definitely, so helpful just kind of break down those barriers and let other women know that like there's no shame in having these feelings. Especially, that fourth trimester, you know,  postpartum, Trying to keep these things in along with adjusting to motherhood in general and going from one to two babies I don't know about you, but that was like rocked my world  It's it's a lot and so now to  feel any kind of guilt or shame about feeling honest raw emotions about  maybe some disappointment with the gender of your baby.

It's not fair for women to go through that alone, and there's no shame in it, because they're real feelings, and I read something that said,  you know, every relationship that you go into, there's always gonna be some sort of disappointment from someone. No one's perfect, and whether they Did it or that's just who they are  and it's the same with your own baby.

There's no relationship is perfect So you're not going to feel all of the things Perfectly for any one person that you ever meet and that includes your baby. So it's totally normal to have any level of Disappointment about something that doesn't go the way that you thought it would  so I'm really glad that that we're talking about this because it's common.

I know it is and no one is talking about it. And I think too that even women who have maybe they,  struggled with loss. or infertility or some sort of trauma, it kind of like clouds it even more because there's all those phrases, whether being told to them or in your own head over and over, you know, like, Oh, I should just be happy.

I should just be grateful that I have children. You know, there's people who don't have children and I have two children. And, and so you this, there's this like loop  in your head sometimes of,  you're not worthy of feeling. Any kind of way other than grateful and happy for what you have and it's it's just not true. All the feelings are okay 

Yes. Yeah, I feel like people just are expected to throw away their ideals and everything that they've thought about forever and, you know, well, you know, this is, this is your life. You got to deal with it and, you should be grateful because, you know, there's people out there that can't have kids and, you know, all that kind of stuff.

And it's like, but I am grateful, but I'm not, that doesn't take away. Exactly. No, it's, it's a different, and, As you said, there's layers to it and it does go deeper because it's not always just you know I wanted a girl and I got a boy or I wanted a boy and I got a girl You know, it's not always just that there's those underlying Desires that you have that yeah, you know span pretty much the rest of your life, you know, there's people out there that there's women that have all girls that think about, you know, well, I'm never going to have that mother son dance at a wedding, in the future or vice versa, even dads,  there might be dads out there that are like, I really want a little girl so I can have the dance with them, or like give them away or, you know, like there's those, and really, We don't know if there's going to be a wedding in the future, you know, those are exactly, these are the things that it's like, it's so, it's so confusing almost because there's just so many things going on in your head.

Well, this is what I should want, but this is what I do want, but this is what I have. And this can't happen, but maybe it can, you know, there's just like all of this stuff and it, it really can create some negative feelings and it really can get some people down,  and some people. I feel like handle it better than others, but, you know, especially when you're pregnant or postpartum and you're dealing with, additional hormonal shifts and, and, you know, your start of a new life, basically, when you have kids and adjusting to other things, I feel like that can make it even worse that you go down these spirals of.

Trying to map out your whole life based on, this little baby and what you,  had dreamed and hoped, but also what society is telling you is going to happen with this little baby. And it's like,  well, no, we need to pause. We need to understand that, we're allowed to.

Be disappointed. But we also have to, work on changing our mindset as well. We kind of have to give ourselves time to grieve, but then, you know, really try to put it into perspective. And I feel like that helped me. Yeah. At least, um,  trying to be like, well, why do I want a girl? You know?

Yeah. What is it, what is it about having a little girl that I want? Is it because I want to go, dress shopping or get my nails done? Mm hmm. Is it because I feel like when boys are older, they're never going to want to come see me? Is it because I don't want to be, you know, the monster in law that I hear about all the time?

You know, about how mother in laws are like horrible, ? I love my mother in law, so that's not always the case. Yes. Um, is it because my whole family wanted a girl? You know, is that really why? Because I didn't want to disappoint people. Was it because I was told my whole life that that's what I should want to have?

I should want to have a boy, a girl, two kids, that's it. And be this perfect little family. And, you know, that's not the perfect family for everyone. So I kind of had to go through every single point and  almost talk to myself about it, and try to work through it.

I think that's really great advice for anyone who is struggling with this, you know,  get curious about your own feelings, turn into it and ask yourself the questions that you said, you know. Why do I want a girl? Why is this affecting me so bad? Because, yeah, I think everyone will have  different answers.

I know my husband and I went through this a little bit when we decided that surrogacy was going to be our next path of growing our family. And, since we had done, IVF, we had embryos and we did not test the embryos prior. So, like, we didn't choose our embryos, you know, we just went with the healthiest ones, to have our boys, and they just.

Happened to put in both boys and I didn't want control of that anyway, because there's already so much planned and it was stressful. But, going into this new journey after another loss, we really just wanted to make sure genetically everything was okay. And because with the path of surrogacy, it's probably not something that we were going to do multiple times.

You know, my vision of Four kids, five kids, or whatever I thought, that had changed. So, um, you know, we decided to find out the sex of the two healthy embryos we had. We had five tested, and only found out the ones that were viable. But before we found out, I told my husband, we had this talk.

I'm like, I don't want to have a third child unless it's because we want a third child. Not just for  A girl, because I'm not gonna test our embryos, they find out that they're boys, and then either  leave them behind, knowing that they're boys, like I didn't want to know, um, the gender of them, I wanted to make sure that our decision was based off of wanting a third child regardless, because if we weren't in this situation doing IVF, we wouldn't be able to choose, and, that was important to me, which required a lot of, changing my mindset, and, really diving deep and like why am I putting so much pressure on really wanting a girl?

Is it because the babies we lost were girls? Is it because that's what I had already always imagined? Is it because, you know, I have a very close relationship with my mom. She's like my best friend and I had this vision that that could, be my situation as well. But like you said, it really doesn't matter because every person, every baby is totally different and everyone's personalities are different and.

Their experiences are different too, and a lot of that is out of our control, you know, we're going to raise our kids, but , then the world is going to take over as well, and to some extent, and I could have a daughter and she could decide to move across the world for a job, and that might look different than my son who might decide to live down the street, you know, it's just, there's so many variables, So I think we've just kind of been programmed over the years to have these ideas of what our families should look like and could look like, and I think the more we have these conversations, we can kind of knock down those barriers and just kind of celebrate the different ideas of.

How families are made and, the different ways that families look in general, and how every scenario is really beautiful in its own way, and we can't, unfortunately, as much as my Type A tries and tries to control. Everything and my future and everything. It's just, um, that's just not how it works. So 

yeah. Yeah. And all of this, I mean, there are people out there that have had all girls and want a boy, you know, and, and it's the same thing. So all of be flip flopped.  But yeah, I'm just really happy to be able to talk about it and show people too that there's a light at the end of  the tunnel as well, you know, I've, I've worked through all those feelings that I had and, you know, I've come out of it and if we were to decide to have a third child, which is kind of undecided at this point.

Yeah.  Because I've kind of changed my mindset on, I was only always told two children. That's it. Like, if you have more, it's a problem. And, I've worked through this mindset so much that I'm like, well, if we choose to have a third child, then, you know, I shouldn't be listening to outside influences.

I should do what I feel is right for my family. But if we were to, I would be completely fine with another boy. And I truly believe that, and I've gotten to a point where I am, I'm okay with that. And, I told myself the same thing, if we were going to have another child, I don't want it to be because I'm striving for a girl.

That shouldn't be how it is. And, I'm finally to a place where I'm, I'm good with that. We're still undecided on whether we actually want. Yeah, yeah. But I think that's an important step. Oh, yeah. Oh, my gosh.  Yeah, so I, I just, I'm hopeful that, I can help somebody else through these feelings if somebody's, really struggling right now, they can hear this conversation and  feel as though, look, your life isn't set in stone, you have this beautiful child that I'm sure you love to pieces, don't let it.

People influence your view of that child or what your life's going to be,  really,  it is what you make it and boys are amazing and girls are amazing and I'm happy for everyone that gets the opportunity to Have a child and I really hope this helps somebody 

I'm hoping so too. I think it's very eye opening and I love that we  talked about this today because I think the biggest takeaway is that women need to know that they're not alone in these feelings and that they're real and that it's okay to feel this way. When you were talking about that you've come to a place now, whether you decide to have a third child or not, you're at a place where you feel good about if it's a boy and it's a boy, like we want to pursue it to pursue a third child regardless. I think that's solid advice too for anyone.

Who maybe  realizes that they do, have your your mind kind of set on a certain gender of your next baby. I would kind of encourage anyone in that position to just really start taking stock of your feelings and why you're feeling that way.

prior to having your child or maybe you're pregnant and you haven't found out yet, but you've got it in your mind what you really want, um, you know, just kind of have a plan ahead of time and also just a plan to kind of process it because even though you can tell yourself that you feel a certain way, once it happens to you, feelings are going to be natural and they're going to come regardless.

So that might mean not doing a very public gender reveal and finding out in front of. A hundred people, you know, like maybe you find out privately and take time to process it. You know, maybe skip the big public reveal that could help.  But yeah, things to just think about when you're going into this, because you want to be feeling your best self too, when you have your baby and you're going through postpartum and everything.

And so now anyone could reach out to you and to me, this is a great topic. I, I love talking about it, so no one should have to feel alone. With the feelings of gender disappointment because it's very real. 

Yeah. Yeah. And people don't have to announce it to everybody that they're disappointed either. You know, people want to keep it in. They can, but they, they should know that there are people out there that are feeling the same way, even if they're not talking about it, you know, because if you're feeling like you don't want to talk about it with other people, just imagine that other people are feeling that same way.

 We're not alone and it can be a very fleeting thing, some people can experience it for, you know, a day and be over it, where, whereas for some people it may take a very long time  I want people to know that they're not alone and yeah, there are people out there feeling the same way you do and, and it's okay.

Yes. Absolutely. Well, thank you so much, Corey, for, shedding light on this topic and sharing your own experience. it is really brave to talk out loud about this in hopes of helping other people. So I so appreciate it. And I know listeners are going to hopefully feel supported and just kind of had their eyes open to this topic a little bit more and not be afraid. to talk about it and really process their own feelings and hopefully the tips we talked about can be helpful to them.  Thank you for joining me today. It was so nice to hear your story and to get your take on this. Yeah. Thank you so much.

Thanks for listening. If you yourself have experienced the feelings of gender disappointment, I hope this episode can validate those feelings for you and let you know that you are not alone. This is a real emotion, something that you're probably not seeing as you scroll your Instagram feed, right?

But it's real. And there are other moms out there and dads that are experiencing this gender disappointment when finding out the sex of their baby. And if you haven't experienced this specific situation, I hope it's educated you on what other moms might be feeling. I think the more we can talk about topics like this, the more we can support those that we love around us.

I'm all about being honest here on the podcast. This is a judgment free zone and I love welcoming guests who are willing to be vulnerable and be honest with what they're experiencing and hopes of educating others and supporting others who might feel the same.

We're definitely living in a time where gender stereotypes are being broken down and I think that is a very real conversation to have when you are expecting a baby. I mean, just because you find out that you're having a boy or having a girl, that does not dictate how their lives are going to go or how your motherhood journey is going to go.

Whether you are expecting a boy or a girl, they are going to be who they are. And I think the moment that society can stop putting so much pressure and narratives surrounding females and males, I think the sooner that we can all enjoy our children for who they are.

Like we mentioned, if you are a mom and expecting a girl, you could be best friends. You could have this whole picture perfect thing that you have in your brain of what that relationship might look like. But you can also have that same relationship with your son, and vice versa. We need to break down these stereotypes so moms can just love their children as they are. No expectations of the ratio of boys to girls in your family, but just pure love and opening up your heart to the experiences to come. You're in charge of the relationship you have with your child and that is not dependent on their gender or their biological sex.

Thank you so much for listening today. I hope you'll tune in next week. I have a bonus episode in store for you where I will be interviewing my brother, and we are talking about a hard topic. 

He's  going to be chatting about his experience of fatherhood in the first year, but also fatherhood alongside battling addiction. I hope you'll tune in.  This conversation is definitely going beyond the highlight reel and I'm so proud of him for opening up and chatting about his experiences. So I hope you'll take a listen when that airs. 

And I also have the pleasure of welcoming on both of my sister in laws to the show next week, and I get to pick their brains about motherhood in the first year as they are both new moms, one with an eight month old and one with a 13 month old.

And it has been so fun watching my niece and nephew grow over the last year, and I'm just excited to talk to them and get their take on their pregnancy experiences and motherhood. And most importantly, I get to pick their brain about All the baby products. While I'm a seasoned mom expecting my third, it has been almost four and a half years since I've been in the newborn phase.

And I know it's like riding a bike, I do. But as far as products go, I don't even know what is out there. And I have watched them use the coolest gadgets and have the best products, so I am so excited to pick their brain. you're expecting and wanting to build a registry, or just curious about what baby products are out there, maybe you have people in your life that you're wanting to gift things to, definitely take a listen next week because we're diving into it all.  It's a fun conversation, and I can't wait for you to hear it. Until then, have a great rest of your week, and I will talk to you then.